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HoneyBucket at Commons to be removed

(138 posts)

Started 5 months ago by Norge
Latest reply from great idea

Norge

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Has anyone else seen the results of the survey 302 people participated in regarding the Honey Bucket at the Commons? It is 69 pages long. The Parks Dept is going to remove it. The results list every comment made by every poster to each question asked. Supposedly a letter from the Parks Dept or Health & Human Services will follow but so far I haven't seen that. I would post the results but it came to my work email and I don't have access now.

Posted 5 months ago #
Compass Rose

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Good! I'll be glad to see that gone. The former location on Market Street was a better one.

Posted 5 months ago #
great idea

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great! I guess I can expect to find more fecal matter in my yard!

perhaps there's a chance Gordon Ramsay will be walking through Ballard Commons and he will scold the homeless guy for pooing in a counter-clockwise fashion when he's living in the Northern Hemisphere.

for bloody sake!

Posted 5 months ago #
teigyr

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Oooh, we drove up by all the Ramsay portables tonight. GI, might I project fecal matter into your yard? Or if it's more polite, maybe I can just squat quietly?

Now I need to go play Angry Birds Star Trek Style.

:)

Posted 5 months ago #
great idea

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is their crew really that big that they need portables??

or was their some 'kitchen nightmare 5k' no one told me about?

Posted 5 months ago #
teigyr

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ohmygosh, there were portables right there and portables on the opposite side of the street and portables a 1/2 a block up.

Kitchen nightmare 5k would be FUN. Imagine - instead of colors being flung at you it could be bits of food. You'd be darned edible at the end and would have no need to go to Pesos or have a reason to scrounge for food when nobody is open for breakfast.

Posted 5 months ago #
great idea

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plus, having that guy (GR) yell at you as you turn around for the second half:

"what's the matter with you?!!
your running form is dreadful-- I've seen welsh rabbits move their arms better!

you get your arse moving before I have to put my boot someplace to motivate you!"

Posted 5 months ago #
stopgo

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Today is a victory for all who thrive on the homeless being forced to shit themselves or shit in someones alley. Hooray for us, it was just making me SICK to let those swine use a toilet.

Posted 5 months ago #
pennygirl

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gi...

Welsh Rarebit. That would have been funnier :-)

Maybe the honeybucket could be moved somewhere else. I don't think it's a good idea to take away someone's bathroom. I know the contraptions are stinky (well, not at this time of year) but I think it's silly just to remove it without placing it somewhere nearby.

Posted 5 months ago #
stopgo

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why can't they just stop going to the bathroom altogether. they don't pay for services, so they should learn to stop shitting.

Posted 5 months ago #
VeganBiker

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Darn, this is one "welsh rabbit" that will miss it if they remove it. I found it came in handy a couple of times and it is not that bad.

Posted 5 months ago #
SmartsyArtsy

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I say get some bricks and mortar and build a "proper" looking toilet room

Posted 5 months ago #
VeganBiker

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SA - easier and cheaper to use a Porta Potty, they can be swapped out if they get fouled or hit with graffiti. Maintaining a "real" toilet costs more money and the Parks Department would have to maintain it on their tight budget.

Posted 5 months ago #
Mondoman

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Hey, VB, sorry for the threadjack, but your avatar prompts me to ask if you had a good-tasting vegan Thanksgiving? Did you go "faux" meat or hearty veggie?

Posted 5 months ago #
Compass Rose

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I'd prefer a real bathroom building as well but understand that would cost a lot more money. If there has to be a Honey Bucket, though, don't put it next to a park where it's a total eyesore, especially a park where there are already issues with drunks, vagrants and illegal behavior. WTF is wrong with you people that you don't get that?

Posted 5 months ago #
BuffaloHawk

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I think if Henry painted the honey bucket it would fit in:)

fwiw .. I picked up Xanadu on vinyl so having a deliciously bad music evening

Posted 5 months ago #
Compass Rose

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BH, that is just plain awesome. I would love to hear that album right now.

Posted 5 months ago #
teigyr

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Doesn't the city have problems with "real" bathrooms? We had those expensive ones downtown and they ended up having hooker and drug problems in them.

Posted 5 months ago #
great idea

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I don't think those were 'real' bathrooms--just extra fancy portable ones that clean themselves when the occupant leaves.

Most brick-and-mortar bathrooms I've seen in parks are pretty nasty. as mentioned above they get hit w/ graffiti a lot, and are sometimes poorly maintaine or just closed.
would such a building be better than what we have? I think so.
I've used that one at Gilman Pk. a million times.

the current problem is really about urban design/visibility. I always thought that it belonged closer to the building (qfc) instead of sitting way out near the street-scape.

the residence of that building probably aren't too keen on sightlines toward the port-o-potty, but maybe it could be shielded by some sort of screen (from above).

keep the door/entry well-lit and not too far off the main sidewalk and you've got convenience w/o the prominent eyesore.

it's a shame the people offended by the sight of this were more diligent about filling out the survey than those who thought it helped.

Posted 5 months ago #
OingoBoingo

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With so many of the 'element' hanging out around St Luke church, why not there? They have toilets. PLOs, permanent latrine orderlies, could monitor and clean up after the respectful users and be clean themselves. A daring prospect but faith might well will out on this one.
Any takers?

Posted 5 months ago #
great idea

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It really belongs in the park.

as veganbiker pointed out, it wasn't only used by the 'element'.

there's sometimes lots of kids down there, and I'm sure they'll be looking for a place to go, too.

Posted 5 months ago #
great idea

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the more I think about it, the problem could also have been solved if the QFC was designed to somehow open to the park with a vestibule area between w/ restrooms.

it's a 24/7 market and I'm sure there's public washrooms in there somewhere.

Posted 5 months ago #
Corvus

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Is it available on line, Norge? I haven't been able to locate it.

Posted 5 months ago #
Norge

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It was sent to me via email by Edwin Obras from the Human Services Dept. The Parks Dept. is also involved. I don't know if either department could have posted this. As I said earlier it was sent to my work email and I didn't sent it home. I know it was done through SurveyMonkey and it's called "Ballard Commons Park Portable Toilet Survey." There are no codes at the bottom of the pages to guide me to any wetbsite. Perhaps they are waiting on that follow up letter before they post the results. I will definitely send the email home on Monday or see if I can figure out how to post it to the forum. I do have to warn you, I don't know if I can post it. If you give me your email I can forward it to you.

Posted 5 months ago #
Norge

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I actually printed it off and have it here at home. And I was wrong above -- 332 people responded to the survey.

Posted 5 months ago #
Corvus

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I would be curious to read some of it. I have no intention of reading all of it. My old handle is cdpenne at the warmer than warm mail place with the usual dot and com.

Posted 5 months ago #
great idea

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do you really believe some 'survey-monkey' is going to give you a true indication of the need/sentiment in the area?

they should have just gotten a real monkey with a clip-board to poll people as they come out from pooing or peeing.

Posted 5 months ago #
onederfullone

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'a real monkey with a clip-board'

GI is volunteering, clearly, to take a 'real survey' of what folks think.

btw, a survey is done without preconceived results, which makes you perfect for the job. /sarcasm.

This means that everyone in Ballard needs a public restroom. I truly believe that GI's bathroom would make a great test model for the new Ballard push.

Good riddance of the latest bum magnet, let's move 'forward'.

Maybe I'm jaded, still, but GI's bathroom, while filthy, will do in a pinch.

Yeah, I said pinch.

Posted 5 months ago #
Corvus

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Hey Norge, this should be fun. Guess which comments are mine. Post them here and I'll tell you if you got it right.

Posted 5 months ago #
onederfullone

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It's all about you, always.

"I would be curious to read some of it. I have no intention of reading all of it."

Just all of what you posted. Maybe clip-board monkey will make certain your opinion is duplicated for you.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=s2B3gPY5LRg

Posted 5 months ago #
nwcitizen

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Better designs for public restrooms:

Victoria, BC
http://www.canadiandesignresource.ca/officialgallery/urban/21st-century-pissoir/

Portland, OR
http://www.theatlanticcities.com/design/2012/01/why-portlands-public-toilets-succeeded-where-others-failed/1020/

Posted 5 months ago #
Corvus

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Actually I know what I wrote. I am curious to read what others wrote and I thought it might be fun to try and guess who's comments went with which MB persona. Except I have absolutely no interest in reading your opinions because your schtick is tiresome, boring and shallow, as usual.

I wouldn't read all of it because 59 pages is more than the subject is worth.

Posted 5 months ago #
onederfullone

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ooooh, all we need is better shitter architecture?

My God, when will you people get it? We already have the record for dollars crapped out for port-a-potties. We sold them on e-bay for pennies on the dollar. Remember?

Nice, cyclists in Portland carry their own tp, priceless...

Posted 5 months ago #
Bird

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Am I the only one amused by using "GI" in this potty thread?

Posted 5 months ago #
Norge

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Okay Corvus here goes:

ONLY if it is serviced regularly. Until the new Compass building with the toilets and showers for the homeless people is completed, the homeless people only have the Ballard Public Library to use. I'd like to take some of the pressure off the Library. Part of me wants to set up a portable toilet close to the train tracks where homeless people cluster in good weather and tend to camp in the blackberry bushes. If the City of Seattle and the people of Ballard decide to adopt a zero tolerance policy toward loitering in Ballard Commons Park, I would set up a 12-month-per-year port-a-toilet close to the Marvin Oliver sculpture at the West end of the Ballard Locks somewhere. I've often wished we as a society were less tolerant of drunken and disorderly behavior. I stood and watched a very dirty homeless man wash his armpits in the fountain less than 18 inches away from a toddler. We have seen several shouting matches. My daughter (9 years old) prefers not to spend time there, but we pass through for various reasons. If she doesn't feel safe, I believe her. I am working on my level of tolerance because I know many people don't have that much choice. But I do
have standards of behavior that are often violated by people who loiter at the park. I don't like the drug dealing, I don't like the open drinking or the loud swearing. Would removing the toilet make it less tolerable for the vagrant types? Yes. However, if there is no strategy or plan in place to encourage them to move or discourage from staying, I'm for a toilet--for now.

Develop a strategy to remove the toilet when Compass Housing is developed. Or make an agreement with the church across the street to host the portable toilet and have it serviced by the City for now.

I have not personally seen people shooting up or that kind of thing. I do agree that all people need a sanitary place to go to the bathroom.

It would be alleviated by the Compass Housing group, but perhaps more research is needed about the portable aspect of this issue.

Church across the street. By the Marvin Oliver sculpture West of the Locks. Between the Burger King and Ballard Market on 15th (another homeless cluster there, mostly drunken native americans.) In the parking lot of the low income housing development on 58th and 25th NW.

How did I do? As an FYI - if I got the first post right, I know the rest are right.

Posted 5 months ago #
Corvus

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Nope that is not me, but I don't think that is a bad guess and could easily come around to agreeing with most or all of what the person stated. I am glad they took the time to type out thoughtful answer.

I am guessing this one could be yours...

"I am not sure that there is a real need for the toilets. There are public toilets
located across the street at the library! I might feel differently if there is evidence
that during the trial period it has made a real, tangible difference in the
community. Is the park cleaner as a result? Not that I have noticed but maybe
someone who is responsible for cleaning the park has a different opinion? I am
open to hearing the evidence that supports the presence of the toilets. If they
are there for the homeless population, it is not a real solution. It is a bandaid. I
don't think we should cover our neighborhood in bandaids. But we can talk about
real solutions."

And I think this one could be Compass Rose because she mentioned the Yankee diner...

"Because I live across the street from it and I walk my dog in the park. I have
seen naked people sleeping next to it, kids locking there friends in it and its not a
well lit place at night now that it gets dark earlier I feel unsafe. Why not have it
over close to the Old Yankee Dinner, and use places that is not being used like
that area for the homeless to park instead of taking space from businesses and
homes."

Posted 5 months ago #
great idea

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for a few thousand bucks, they probably could've commisioned an actual study to determine usage and other 'real' issues surrounding the port-o-potty.

while it's great to see that some responders wrote long, thought-out answers, the perceived threat of a plastic box is much greater than the reality.

Posted 5 months ago #
Corvus

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I thought this one could be yours GI...

"There is a considerable homeless population in and around Ballard. Access to
basic sanitation resources for these folks is pretty much limited to places like the
library or other public locations in the area. These institutions are not open 24
hours a day. Even when the Urban Rest Stop is built that will not provide 24
hour access. Access to a public toilet facility like a portable toilet helps meet a
very basic need of our homeless population."

Posted 5 months ago #
Norge

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Nope, that's not mine -- a hint -- I posted on November 6.

Posted 5 months ago #
great idea

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not mine either corvus, but it could've been!

Posted 5 months ago #
Corvus

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So who has an account with a hosting service so we can easily post the results for everyone to read?

Posted 5 months ago #
Corvus

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Ok Norge, how about this one...

"There has been an increase in homeless people in the park since it has been put
in. I see many homeless people congregating around the toilet, sometimes
multiple people going into it. There has also been an increase in illegal activity
and calls to police. There has been an increased police presence in the park as
well, due to the increasing number of homeless people there. It has brought
more problems to an already problem plagued park. Please remove it."

I posted on the 7th. I hadn't noticed the descending order before.

Posted 5 months ago #
pennygirl

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"There is a considerable homeless population in and around Ballard. Access to
basic sanitation resources for these folks is pretty much limited to places like the
library or other public locations in the area. These institutions are not open 24
hours a day. Even when the Urban Rest Stop is built that will not provide 24
hour access. Access to a public toilet facility like a portable toilet helps meet a
very basic need of our homeless population."

Actually, that one could be down to any number of people on this forum, me included.

Posted 5 months ago #
Norge

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Nope -- not only is there the date for posting, but the time. So if you spot one post you will find them all.

Posted 5 months ago #
nwcitizen

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To view results of survey, click on link on right side of this page.
(click again on small image to make it full size)
http://bcthh.pbworks.com

Posted 5 months ago #
great idea

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thanks for that link nwcitizen.

seems like most complaints were that it's "ugly" or "an eyesore."
no one wants to look at it.

interesting that although some thought it should be moved, more thought that Ballard shouldn't have any public toilets at all.
I didn't realize so many locals had colostomies.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZBxKpRd6_t8

Posted 5 months ago #
Mondoman

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Perhaps most have learned to plan for their personal daily needs rather than just making use of any nearby surface when the urge strikes?

Posted 5 months ago #
RichY

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I didn't realize so many locals had colostomies.

No, they are Just anal retentive

Posted 5 months ago #
onederfullone

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I don't know why we even vote. Clearly a plethora of blog posts from a few that need to experience relevance in their life via Internet Pablum's are king, and maybe even hold a 'mandate' for all thought in Ballard.

I guess I post because I don't see any mandate, or relevance. Opinions that enable opt-out asswipes are irrelevant. Period. Enable opt-in asswipes, and we can come to an agreement.

I don't hold my breath, primarily because opt-in asswipes aren't looking for a nipple, but a fair shake in Seattle. Looking for a fair shake in Seattle, lol, it's an oxymoron that expects anything of the sort.

Clearly, they will camp elsewhere and make something of themselves. Ballard needs to be an opt-out society, where be embrace millions of our revenue being dedicated to the influence of opt-out shitters. Maybe we can re-buy our e-bay shitters and plant them in Ballard. At least it will assuage you morons who insist it's no problem.

I would assume I've used up my uses of asswipes and shitters in one post...

Just in case. Asswipes. Shitters. Ballard. 'Maybe' it will be prophetic.

Posted 5 months ago #
Corvus

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The confused ramblings of a blithering idiot. What you are missing, Onedy, as usual, is the honest debate which is what creates consensus. You would rather close conversation in your nerver ending attempt to get in the last word, even if it is useless. If you can't add something useful and not written in your strange code, you really should just get lost.

Posted 5 months ago #
Compass Rose

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Nope, that wasn't me. I don't have a dog and never mentioned the Old Yankee Diner. Was that the place where the Goodwill drop-off is?

Posted 5 months ago #
onederfullone

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"The confused ramblings of a blithering idiot"

Which you can only find here, apparently.

"What you are missing, Onedy, as usual, is the honest debate which is what creates consensus."

What you lack, as usual, is an honest debate. It's dishonest bullying which gets you off. Explains your fetish for Obama, frankly.

As long as you get your jollies, who gives a facebook?

Not me. Vap__ T__t.

Posted 5 months ago #
great idea

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the old Yankee Diner site seems like a strange place to put a port-o-potty.

there is a goodwill drop-off there, but not much else. if they think this unit attracts crime now, put it in the yankee lot, where you'll see a scary part of town develop.

the potty needs to be services (library, market, and yes, park).

Posted 5 months ago #
lakreitz

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The author of comment #130 must be my long lost twin.

Posted 5 months ago #
Norge

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GI - you are really having trouble with the results of the survey and the fact that people don't have the same perspective you do? The Ballard Task Force on Homelessness is looking for people to join up and assist them in enabling the homeless in Ballard -- might be something that might interest you.

Posted 5 months ago #
great idea

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it might be, and I'll look into it.

as I mentioned, most of the anti-potty sentiment stems from the way it doesn't quite fit in with the neighborhood.

that does trouble me. it's not only about the homeless either, but a callous disregard to how any normal human being might use the park.
whether older folk, or kids runnning through the sprinkler that really need to go (during that week in August when the library is conveniently closed), we are all getting screwed by having this fixture removed.

oh, and careful where you step.

Posted 5 months ago #
GAM

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I scarcely noticed it. Unsightly? Discrete is the word I'd use. It was way off to the side out of the way. Sure, an attractive shell for it would have prettier, but it was what it was and I never gave it a second thought. I was too busy watching kids in the fountain and the skateboarders. If I'm thinking anything about aesthetics in the park it's that it is a huge improvement over the Safeway.

Posted 5 months ago #
racerX

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Safeway?

Posted 5 months ago #
Norge

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The Commons Park used to be the site of a Safeway store.

Posted 5 months ago #
Compass Rose

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Thanks for the links to those stories, NWcitizen. The Portland story was great. And I like both of these designs for public bathrooms. They address the objections I have to the Honeybucket at Ballard Commons - namely, that it provides a fully enclosed, private space that only encourages illegal behavior, and is also an eyesore. If there's a need to a bathroom in that area, I wish Seattle would follow Vancouver or Portland's lead and install one like either of those.

Posted 5 months ago #

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HoneyBucket at Commons to be removed

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