not sure any partnership with SHARE is a good idea.....but appreciate Pastor Grumm taking the neighborhod and community into consideration after all the emotional response.

Let's delay it for eternity and call it a day. It was a bad idea with disastrous consequences for the community.

"Pastor Steve" is a dope.

Keep fighting folks, don't let them turn Ballard into a magnet for vagrants. Those folks who think we should be a model for the world can open up their homes.

Hold their feet to the fire til they run off and find another community of suckers to screw.

Yeah!

Charity begins at home.

Whose home, mine? I don't need charity, thanks.

Fremont is full of hippies, why not try them?

This is off topic, but I really like that building. I wish I had the money to buy it.

As a community we should try to help our neightbors in tough times, but not bus fulls of homeless dropped off here becuase we let them get away with so much! I think we should be known for being helpful, but also prtotective of our communtity too. Charity does begin at home and we have plenty of folks right here in our zip code that need help before the ones who were dropped off here and have hosts of other issues like drug, alcohol and mental issues. Ballard is not a respository for those released from jail with no where else to go...or booted from other places and ending up here.

ballard guy you are our saviour. thank you so much for saving us from the evil homeless. its pretty easy to pick on the disenfranchised isnt it big guy. total loser.

well done ballard! our voice was heard. now we need to keep it up!

The idea that the homeless are all "vagrants" smacks of the late Richard Nixon's calling war protestors all "bums," back in the 1960s.

We're talking about 20 people here, all vetted by the pastor. Back when I lived down in Greenlake, the now defunct Ravenna Boulevard Presbyterian Church's counseling office wouldn't help me find a place; for a homeless guy who'd been sleeping in the laundry room of the apartment complex where I lived.

He was left to fend for himself and probably is dead now. Jesus said that when you help the poor, you were helping him, did he not? Since America fancies itself a Christian nation, it should step up to the task and help 20 poor wretches who simply need a place to call home, even if temporarily.

terry-

don't know where you've been for that last 8 years, but we don't fancy ourselves as a christian nation at all. at least not on the west coast. good people i will buy, but not christians.

Terry - Too bad, but the word "homeless" evokes a lot more than some poor soul that just needs a hand up. Those days are long gone. Ballard is toxic with homeless folks. For better or worse the scurvy crew that loiter about Ballard have ruined it for those that might actually benefit from this shelter. SHARE and the Pastor were less than forthcoming and seemed to be willing to lie to get this shelter to happen. Thats some real Christian behavior there all right. Yah sure you betcha.

Why is it that the neighborhood should just clam up and let this happen? Don't they count?

From Wikipedia:

The Golden Rule was a common principle in ancient Greek philosophy. A few examples:

"Do not to your neighbor what you would take ill from him." (Pittacus)[3]
"Avoid doing what you would blame others for doing." (Thales)[4]
"What you wish your neighbors to be to you, such be also to them." (Sextus the Pythagorean)[5]
"Do not do to others what would anger you if done to you by others." (Isocrates)[6]
"What thou avoidest suffering thyself seek not to impose on others." (Epictetus)[7]
"It is impossible to live a pleasant life without living wisely and well and justly (agreeing 'neither to harm nor be harmed'[8]),
and it is impossible to live wisely and well and justly without living a pleasant life." (Epicurus)[9]

During the snowstorm, I came across a woman in Fremont begging for spare change to get a cup of coffee, and recognized her. She'd previously been the groundskeeper at a building in the area; she'd left her job a year or so ago when her husband got a lead on a good job elsewhere. His job had vanished in the crumbling economy, and no alternatives materialized; when the money ran out the two of them had ended up on the streets. (They were back in the area to stay with friends, but a loan of a cell phone produced the news that the friends they'd planned to stay with were stranded elsewhere due to the snow.)

A number of us who recognized and remembered her took up an impromptu collection among ourselves at PCC, so that she and her husband could get a room for the night at an inn over in Wallingford. But the encounter really did bring home to me the fact that in this economy if you don't have a cushion of savings to fall back on or a good safety net, /anyone/ can end up on the street.

The ironic thing here is that SHARE is quite strict in its vetting of people in its inside shelters (and also in its Tent Cities). Many people with houses would not make the cut, because they like to have a drink, or they like to argue a bit, or they do other things that aren't seen by others because...because they have a house to hide in. Don't use your assumptions of behaviors as an excuse for your prejudice against homeless people.

Sally -

You obviously weren't there when they described the vetting process. But I was, and here is what it entails: If the person doing the interview liked you, you could stay. That's not an exaggeration. It was that simple. Ask anyone that was there. So don't "use your assumptions of behaviors as an excuse for your" ignorance.

Sally, there have been many police reports and arrests at the various tent cities/shelters. You can go online and look them up. My biggest concern is the sheer number of homeless sex offenders flying under the radar...there are plenty of sex offenders with HOMES, but the police can at least know their whereabouts. This is not acceptable in a neighborhood with a daycare across the street from the shelter.

As I was panhandled AGAIN at Safeway tonight (about 5:00 PM) by some very sketchy guys, I wondered if we didn't allow panhandling, what would happen. And look! It has been banned in Tacoma.
" Consider the elements. Panhandling is not allowed within 15 feet of the following places citywide: building entrances, ATMs, bus stops, parked cars, pay phones, gas stations, car washes, and outdoor cafes. It's not allowed at any time on buses. And you can't panhandle at intersections, freeway ramps, or in any way directed toward traffic. Finally, just to show that begging really isn't welcome in Tacoma, it's prohibited everywhere from dusk to dawn. Period."

http://crosscut.com/2007/12/04/law-justice/9598/

My friend (who, BTW, disagrees with me about Share/Wheel)told me a story about a crazy woman downtown who screams at people if they don't give her money. Another friend attempted to give this woman "tickets" for meals at the Mission...the crazy woman said "I don't want FOOD, I want money to buy drugs!"

Well, at least she is honest. That pretty much sums up the general situation in Ballard right now.

@Rachel: I've heard that story from you before, and because I know you in person, I will vouch that it is legit and that you're just trying to temper the rancor of the discourse. However, that was a very different situation, one which should not be conflated with what is proposed here, and the differences need to be kept clear.

First, a key element is that you and your fellow community members had prior history with this couple and possessed the choice of what help to extend. This is not present here at all under the currently proposed plan. If the roster of residents were fairly stable, then conceivably something could be worked out along those lines.

Second, the dynamics of a lone married couple are very different from those of an all-male group of twenty, comprised of both strangers and confederates. Males who have been homeless themselves, as well as people who have worked with shelters, have already attested to as much in the comments here. Had this been an all-women shelter, there would be no problem.

There is a balance to be maintained here. Say what you will about the end result, but the folks at the food bank (well, most of them) really do bust their asses to responsibly communicate with the surrounding community and manage risks accordingly. This isn't the food bank though, and the handling heretofore has been far from responsible.

Sorry, this is off topic.
But it's a little before 3 am, and for the past 10 minutes or so I've been hearing what I think to be a helicopter circling overhead.
Anyone else hear this?

OK. This thing has been flying over my house for at least a half hour now... it's quite annoying.

I was out in my helicopter seeing if there was any drug activity up on Market. Sorry for the noise

I heard it too, guess it was some sort of crimnal activity...they have K-9's out now.

Well, I think this proves once and for all that there is nothing that will make some of you happy - no process or safeguards that will be enough for you to be willing to help others. I've never seen a bigger group of intolerant, self-centered, jackasses. Fell free to respond with all of your usual nonsense, how I just don't get it, grow up, etc. The church expresses a willingness and establishes a protocol to work with you to address your concerns, essentially everything you were whining about lacking in the past posts, and you just want to give it the finger. NIMBYism at its absolute worst. Heaven forbid any of you ever need the charity of others, or find yourselves in a difficult position, because all you deserve is a spit in the eye. Seriously unbelievable. You all should pass out trophys so you can crow to future generations about your victory over the homeless.

SHARE is nothing more then a Bums On Display organization. Keep them out.

Anyone who accuses this neighborhood of NIMBYism clearly doesn't understand the history of this neighborhood. There is already a free lunch program 4 days a week at this church. This lunch program has been in place for many years, and it brings in probably over 100 homeless individuals a day. Some of these individuals are great and some are not. If this neighborhood is so intolerant as some of you accuse, then why has it cooperated with the lunch program for so long? The neighborhood just can't agree with adding an overnight shelter when Our Redeemer's church is already not providing sufficient oversight of the lunch program.

Being opposed to SHARE is not "picking on the homeless". That's just the usual activist bull being regurgitated by people who can't think for themselves.

As someone who is familiar with the shelter system and who has used homeless services, I strongly feel that SHARE isn't helping anyone, and it exists solely for propaganda purposes.

There is a LOT of help out there, and people who really want to get out of homelessness CAN do it, if they want to. (That would NOT include the legion of so-called "homeless youths" camping all over downtown Seattle.)

While it's always good to assure neighbors understand such actions, what strikes me as odd is how some Ballard folks think it is most populated with homeless folks. Obviously many ought to go to www.homelessinfo.org and check out the last few One Night Counts, and oh by the way, get informed before the homeless bashers exceed the 20 who'd stay in the church shelter. Anyone proud to be a basher,..use your real name when you post so you can be seen standing by your comment. Anyone who stands up to help the church house the homeless and provide support, do the same and show up to help,..please.

Why have the shelter right here? Why not put it in the industrial area towards the airport? There is lots of open space, it is easy to get to downtown, and there are places possible people can get day jobs. Why do we have to have shelters that have no discrimination towards thieves and murderers (lots of these homeless people have pretty bad records) right in an area full of daycares?

Steve Grumm always says he has the community behind him, but when I went to his last meeting only one person in his congregation lived within 5 blocks of the church!

Another very important point to keep in mind is that usually when a church hosts services for the homeless, the church actually resides where the homeless services are offered. In this case, Our Redeemer's is on 85th, but this building is on 70th. The building is vacant and not used for any worship services. Therefore, there are no staff members from the church at this vacant building providing some base level of daily supervision. Instead, that supervision (such as calling the police when fights break out or people are drinking alcohol and using drugs) falls solely on the neighborhood. I just think Our Redeemer's needs to figure out how it can provide more support for this neighborhood before adding more services.

Oh, Seattle and her "tolerant" ways. We talk a big game here. But when it comes times to back up our talk, we become intolerant conservative Republicans.

I mean, what is "controversial" about helping homeless people? Shouldn't that be something we are proud to support? Homelessness is a major problem in our country. Maybe the reason it has not been solved is because anytime someone wants to help, other people deem it too "controversial" for their neighborhood.

Go NIMBY!

What have the homeless done for Ballard or the greater good?

One more reason why the accusations of NIMBYism are completely unfair is that there is already a SHARE shelter at Trinity United Methodist church (two blocks south of this building). No one has a problem with this shelter because it is well-run. Trinity United Methodist resides in the building where the shelter is located so they have a vested interest in overseeing what happens there.

How many residential neighborhoods in Seattle have a food bank, soup kitchen and two SHARE shelters in a two block radius? The problem is not our attitude toward the homeless, the problem is lack of supervision at this vacant building. If you look at the building right now, the sign in front of the church has broken panels, there is graffiti on back of the sign, there is trash on the lawn, and empty beer cans in bushes.

Seems to me that the problem expressed by many is not this shelter but rather the bad behavior of people who are already in the neighborhood. The on-going irritation has caused some people to say enough. Why not talk about that instead of this shelter which has not happened yet.

Incidentally, SHARE has a policy, strictly enforced, that shelter residents are not allowed to be in the neighborhood before or after shelter hours.

What about us NAMBI's huh? You may feel all warm and fuzzy having a shelter in your neighborhood but who do you think has do deal with this people all day, the businesses in the area. As much as I love having to worry about my product being stole and hence food for my families mouth how is it fair to us? Left on a normal basis count add up to 5% of your total sales but when you start adding in a huge group of people who have nothing to lose and will steal to support their habits that number can go up to 8 to 10%. Alot of businesses stay open on that margin. I know according to other posters us local businesses sit around making our millions giving dirty looks all day and damnit we want to be able to continue to sit around doing that. Oh wait, I forgot that is not my life I did see it on some daytime soap once though, I think I had the flu and came home 3 hours early because I was making quite a mess.

My point is this: if you continue to dump more and dump homeless,druggies,drunks into the neighborhood businesses will get fed up and close. It is not pleasant to deal with these types on a daily basis. So for everyone who says there is no compassion, they come into my HOUSE everyday. I spend WAY more time at work then I do at home or the place where I sleep. So when you own your own business it is just like your home.

Do you have to deal with crazy drug addicts coming into your home? Not unless they are family. So all I have to say is STFU until you have had a crazy homeless bastard in your home with a knife then maybe you will understand why businesses get so sick of it.

Thomas, you can vote Democrat and not be a member of the wacky far left, anti-private property, anti- business, squatter rights fringe.

The American dream isn’t built on just getting by and looking for the next church shelter.

jm,

"What have the homeless done for Ballard or the greater good?"

wow. the same question could be asked of you and your probably worthles life. grow up.

These guys never learned to be responsible. They are practiced in the art of just getting by. Knowing how to survive and where to look for the free hand out will only take one so far. Unfortunately, any jobs they might be doing have been taken away by the millions of hard working immigrants.

the 'American dream' Jm, is a sales slogan.

I think if a church wants to host a homeless shelter that they should at least be operating as a weekly church, so that they can have some order of surveilence. A couple of years ago, my group met at a church weekly. We had to move as the craft sink was being used as a urinal. The curtain smelled so strong of urine behind the piano that you couldn't get close to it. They had to be out by 6am but some of them would still be in the parking lot later in the day. They started storing their food supplies inside of drawers in the room also and the smell was getting horrid. We started to bring cleaning aids to clean up the tables etc. If ended up being more then we wanted to do. We left the building to go elsewhere. This is why I say you must have a church presence around. If Our Redeemers is the local church sponser, why not use the large social hall that they have, with kitchen and bathrooms in the same room. It is also on the busline and a little far to walk othewise to local business. They would then get on the share buses to leave the area to wherever. They did a good job of hosting tent city, so why not let them under their roof and inside of their "home". Groups are looking for meeting rooms all over town. get the word out to them for meetings etc. you would make more then the rent you are collecting from Share and not having the damage done to this building and the neighoorhood. This church a beautiful building in a nice area, don't ruin it.

The answer is not simply to send them less than half a mile north to Our Redeemers. That does nothing to get at the underlying issue of Ballard being a soft-touch for poorly put together programs. Also, the neighborhood around the church up there is a nice area, don't ruin it either.

My point was to not to put it in an unoccupied church in someones else back yard. I am starting to hate to go to the Ballard district because of all the homeless here. I will not go to our Library. Go instead to Greenwood or Broadview. Been hasssled going into the new Ballard branch several times, then after going to Bartells have had one come across the street to panhandle again. Refuse to go to Market St Walgreens. Go to 85th Street store. Told a clerk once how nice it was to shop there and not be panhandled to get into the store. She said that they ran them off.
Have thought in the past that the old Hat and Boots location out in the industrial location would be a good place to have a "home" for the homeless With water and sewer and light already hooked up. The city at that time owned the property. Bus routes, fast food, and a day labor business right across the street. With all the industrial there it should be a good place for a chance at jobs. Was told that it was too far out of the rim for their people to go. This conversation was when they were looking for a place for tent city to stay. Our family members commute up to 2 hours a day. And the industrial area is too far out? for the homeless??

SHARE is NOT the only show in town. BOTH of my parents have volunteered for this. Northminster Presbyterian, among others, has dinner several nights a week, and they have 8 men who sleep there. The difference is that it is small (5-8 people) who have all been vetted BY the church, AND there are people there at ALL TIMES. http://www.presbytery.org/LinkClick.aspx?fileti...

Ecumenical Ministry to Homeless, Mentally Ill Adults
Has Congregations Living the Gospel
For the past five years, Northminster Presbyterian Church in Seattle’s Ballard neighborhood has accepted the challenge to manage a specialized shelter to serve homeless, mentally ill adults. The goal is to provide a safe, inviting place on a regular basis to keep the clients (always called “guests” in the shelter) coming back so that they can receive careful assessment, medical and other forms of care, and eventual placement into housing. Eleven congregations provide the 110 volunteers per month needed to staff the shelter, which features an evening meal served family style; an evening of conversation, dominoes, television, or just rest; and overnight sleeping quarters with one male and one female host. One evening a month Northminster’s middle high youth prepare the dinner and serve as evening hosts. The shelter is small, limited to five or six guests per night who are screened by a community mental health agency that serves as partner to the churches. To date, more than sixty guests have been moved into their own housing. Ballard Ecumenical Ministry has given eleven congregations a meaningful ecumenical partnership and a real share in Christ’s ministry in Seattle.



http://www.gbgm-umc.org/crownhillumc/BEM.html

Interestingly enough, I have not heard any complaints from NM Pres. ...which i attend.

NIMBY? We already have this program in 11 churches, plus the SHARE/Wheel program, plus the food bank.

Get off your high horse. I'd say Ballard is already doing a lot.

REPOSTED:
[Phantom_Blut_01.5 (RE:1st Story,#175)]
Just a 2 cents from an ol’snapper-whipper!
I have been watching and acting out here in Bollard(sic)for a while.
Seems,most of you folks on the street still think it’s the 19th.century.
Murricans evolved in-to an nation after the frontier closed in 1912,when Arizona Territory became a state.
U.S.Fed.Marshalls ended.
The new Amerika became an empire before the great war,ww.1.
The industrialists formed a war economy.
War needs cheap peasants.
War needs unemployment,right-to–work(for nothing)states.
Thus,the wEvil wiEmpire(sic) must be fueled with orders from elite "generals" glued to desks at "mount weather".(q.v.)
The rest of us must be aknowleged as,disposable!(peasants=monocrop harvested every 19-20 years,ie)
Policies of the 'elites' guarantee drugging:
Morphine=”soldier’s Joy”,civil war.
Tranks=Housewives=”mother’s little helpers”.
Amphetamines were used officially in every combat theatre since WW2.
Now,the A.F,Army,etc. drugs their elite killer goons.
Used-up "soldiers" with brains fried on drugs now make up a big part of the homeless indigents.
Alchohol=Bronfmann Corporations=firewater.{"No-Body Loves A Drunken Indian”}(Or drunked any-one Else,for that matter!).
Und,ZO:
The Doctors,Lawyers,Indian Chiefs,Poo-Bahs,Pandits,Captains of Industry,Etc. Created "This Empire".
They have to breathe air,drink water,just like "us peasants".
Why do theysuceed by hideing behind theirP.R.flacks, fortified pill-boxes,let the pettittes-bourgeoise blame helpless peasants,numerous others for the sins of Empire??
Why don’t we,ie,the great un-washed, go to the level of the "power elites"(see:C.Wright Mills’book:”The Power Elites”)And:CHALLENGE THEM TO FIX WHAT THEY BROKE???
"R"
My E-Mail:
[RandiO088(at)aim.com]

As a neighbor within 1 block of the church, I have to say that I have been extremely happy with the management of the food bank in the last year. It can't be easy for them to police the blocks around the food bank and also the Calvary where their meal program is held 2 blocks away. I have had to call them several times in the last few months and I say hats off to the staff at the food bank, as they have always responded in a timely manner to remedy the situation. I have called the Seattle Police in a few instances and usually the Ballard Food Bank girls are there first.

Incoming Unintelligable Spam : #44.

Phantom, Does that jibberish even make sense to the author, let alone make a point?

Also the food bank has responded to my compaints outside of their operating hours of Tuesday-Thursday. Maybe someone should be policing this building outside of the food bank and thier staff of only 2 fulltime people?

Church neighbor, I think that you're unintentionally making the opposite point. Having to call the police several times is what a lot of people are hoping to avoid. I haven't had to call the police at all for anything in the past year since I live far enough away from the soup kitchen.

SPG- Homeless population or not, we live in the big city and the ploice are called her a lot. If that doesn't work for you and the neighbors, pack up and move to a more rural area.

police

Re: Bill Post 28.

You provided a nice informative link regarding the count of homeless folks in King County. Seattle is at 1977 on that count. HMMMM, its been well documented that SHARE has been bringing homeless people INTO Seattle from all over the west coast. Why would anybody want to bring homeless people into Seattle? What would the number be if SHARE was not engaged in this activity? 1700? 1500? Who's helping whom???

"What would the number be if SHARE was not engaged in this activity? 1700? 1500? Who’s helping whom???"

If you search "Homeless Seattle" on Flickr.com, you get over 1,500 photos of homeless folks. Smile!

Churchneighbor
That's called settling. You can be lazy and choose this, but don't fault others for trying to improve their neighborhood regardless of the issue.

Yes, and here's a fine example of Seattle's hippie homeless:

http://www.flickr.com/photos/jahat/3064496266/

hippie? They know how to make it work without wandering the streets...lets not add them to the mix!

Why doesn't the government bring back the CCC? (Civilian Conservation Corps.) Between 1933 and 1942, it provided work/shelter/clothing/food for thousands and thousands of unemployed and homeless men.
They built all sorts of buildings and roads in state and national parks, etc.

I suppose that was a different time, when people really were desperate to work, rather than beg.

I do believe that we should follow Tacoma's lead in banning panhandling.

david t- not settling or lazy. Just trying to work with and make the best of what is already here. We live in a big city. Even if the soup kitchen, food bank, and impending shelter were not factors, homelessness would still be an issue and promises to get worse in this bad economy.

Excuses, excuses is the name of the game here. Maybe we should just give each of these homeless people a one-way bus ticket to Portland. Then we would not have to worry our pretty little "liberal" heads about this problem anymore.

The lost people of Ballard need to relearn a good self-image and start being productive. Perhaps some community service work could count toward meals and lodging. Why do these fools think they should get a free ride? They should be ashamed.

Thomas-Come on, even SHARE gives people round trip tickets.

Yeah, more bums is good for business. Adds character to the neighborhood.

I don't think many people are against helping the homeless or even having a homeless shelter near them. What most don't want are homeless people with criminal records. When you rent a place here, there are criminal checks. Is it so bad to ask the same for someone wishing to stay in a shelter?

I am not in anyway saying all homeless people are sex offenders, criminals, drug users, drunks, or mentally ill, but fact is some are. I do not think it is unreasonable to ask for those individuals not to be invited into my neighborhood.

This is a democratic country, if the majority does not want this here, then the church has no right to do this. I say it should all be down to a vote. Perhaps the church should have a ballot and see what the community wants. After all Steve Grumm is always saying the community is behind him, so he shouldn't be worried right?

Sure enough, rent a place and hide your criminal background in your community. Kudoes to those with 1st last and deposit! Whew.

End up homeless and have the same criminal history...
(and think up something good and scary and juicy here a not just J walking or not paying your tickets),
then yes for haven't sake don't put them in a shelter where we know where they are, what their crimes are and the times of day they come and go...leave them out on the street! WHEW! Boy, don't I feel better now!

Call our City FREAKIN' Council and the Mayors Office and tell them how very HAPPY we all are that's is safe for the cruise ship tourists to roam downtown without having to see or smell the homeless and thank them for pushing them into our residential neighborhoods.

Then 3 cheers for Ronald Regan who put the mentally ill on our streets.

Gotta Go..Nancy Grace is on and look....the killer is member of the family...again, who seemed very normal to all their neighbors....now THAT is scary.

So you (A Balard Neighbor) would not mind possibly having a sex offender living next door to you? The registered Sex Offenders list can locate people with a record, but if they are in a shelter (as there is no screening) they would not appear.

Mentally ill people do belong in a hospital (yep Regan was an idiot) and not in a shelter. Remember last year when a homeless guy killed another guy under the bridge at Leary Way, the excuse was he just didn't take his meds! Crazy people do crazy things! If I have a choice I don't want any crazy people near my house.

The shelter is only for night, in the day many of the inhabitants will be wondering around the area.

If the church said, "Okay we are going to have a shelter for all those unlucky people that lost their jobs, and homes, we are going to screen for sex offenders, murder, rape, or robbery charges, if someone has a drug problem or has a violent history we won't let them in." Great! I don't think anyone would object.

We need to find a proper solution for the homeless problem, shelters are not a longterm solution. There needs to be work so people can work their way out of the gutter. I have been in the area for six years now and I have seen the same guys panhandling everyday, and I think "Six years and you can't find any job?"

I am all for helping those that I think deserve to be helped. Contributing to the community is a good thing, but even the ones that are helped need to contribute too, you can't just keep on taking handouts and not give back.

I have a law degree and I couldn't find a job for months and months after I passed the bar, Shane. It is a little tough out there.

>>>It is a little tough out there.

It could be raining gold nuggets and these vagrants wouldn't find work.

It is tough out there..but when the going gets tough where do you turn first?

Your family
Your Friends
community services (your church, etc)
City, state programs

when those are exhausted then it means your family can't or won't help you for whatever reason, and your friends can't or won't help you for whatever reason, and there are no resources left to assit you either becuase you haven't looked into it, or can't abide by their rules...

knowing you have exhausted those efforts is a little scary, and now you want to plop in our community? Why did family and friends not work?

churchneighbor said: "SPG- Homeless population or not, we live in the big city and the ploice are called her a lot. If that doesn’t work for you and the neighbors, pack up and move to a more rural area."

That's not any sort of excuse for criminal behavior. We live in a society, and a neighborhood, that shouldn't have to put up with crime. If there was a drug den moving in next door you'd object, wouldn't you? I don't necessarily equate the two, but you get the point.
I've lived in a few big cities and no, the police didn't need to be called a lot except in places that were crime magnets, like around crack houses and rowdier bars.

Maybe the building should be turned into one of those micro brew pubs. Honey, I am stopping by the church after work tonight.

JM, just as a humorous note; the restaurant on the corner of Fremont and 34th called Costa Opa was at one time a bar called "The Library."
"hey honey, I'm going to the Library!"

That church would have been developed as a resturant if the owner were willing to sell it as one (think barking dog), but they are only willing to sell it as a church.

Is something else happenign at the church now? On both Monday and Tuesday, around 1:30 ,I walked by and they're were people (sorry, I have to say they looked homeless) hanging around. Some in vehicles some just standing there. On Tuesday I asked one of they and they sadi that word is that the shelter was open.

Either something is happening there or word travels quickly amongst the homeless - how, is a mystery to me. In any event, this obviously will attract people other than those being screened and bussed in from the downtown SHARE.

I'm curious if anyone has been noticing anything else going on there.

Joe Ballard - hate to break the news, but you're just plain wrong about the seller only willing to sell it as a church. I think it would be a preference, but I'm sure any reasonable offer would be considered. The problem the location has is that the parking is limited, so I'm not sure it would work as a restaurant.

Concerned neighbor, wow, way to have a heart, my friend.

Heart or reality? Don't confuse compassion with naivete.

Looks like it might not matter what we think:


Bill to protect homeless at Washington churches
THE ASSOCIATED PRESS

OLYMPIA -- A bill making it clear that churches can house the homeless inside or outside passed the state House Tuesday and was sent to the Senate.

Rep. Brendan Williams of Olympia sponsored the bill to counter a homeless ordinance approved last year in Lacey that restricted a tent city known as Camp Quixote.

The Olympian reports the bill would bar some restrictions on church-sponsored homeless camps. Cities and counties would not be able to ban homeless camps near schools or to require liability insurance or that the homeless be housed inside church buildings.

This isn't a church, it's an empty building.

That bill is really bad. Giving an organization (like a church) pretty much a free reign to do what they like without any regard to their neighbors is wrong.

What do I have to do to stop this? Get a partition with thousands of signatures?

Article regarding the Bill.

http://www.theolympian.com/editorials/story/772...

The bill (HB 1956) has passed in the State House 56 to 41. Our Ballard area representative Mary Lou Dickerson is one of the sponsors. Details on the bill can be found at:

http://apps.leg.wa.gov/billinfo/summary.aspx?ye...

The first reading is scheduled for today (March 5th) in the state senate.

If you have concerns with this bill please contact your state representatives. For most of the Ballard area they are: Representative Mary Lou Dickerson, Representative Reuven Carlyle and Senator Jeanne Kohl-Welles. One way to contact them is through the email on the state legislature web site:

http://apps.leg.wa.gov/DistrictFinder/results.a...

Anybody know how the meeting went this evening? I couldn't make it. :-(

Oh, I am sure the meeting featured people complaining about how this is such an awful idea for Ballard.

I was told by a representative of Reuven Carlyle that there would be a town hall meeting at the Phinney Association location (brick building in the back) on March 14th at 10:00 a.m. Both he and Mary Lou Dickerson will be attending. The meeting is intended to present concerns about the State budget but he said comments on this issues are welcome too. I'm kind of surprised that I haven't seen anything about it on this site but maybe I'm not looking in the right places.

Another reason I don't want a church housing sex offenders near me :-

http://www.cnn.com/2009/CRIME/03/12/sex.offende...

Remember in the meeting they said they will not screen for sex offenders.